Marilyn,
Thanks for sharing that article.  I gave it a brief run-through and thought it was pretty interesting, so I'm hoping to give it some more attention.
I am glad that the author didn't try to minimize motherhood!  I know my young women think motherhood is not a fair "power" or stewardship, so I'm constantly on the hunt for ideas on how to help them process that motherhood is not a negative.  A big part of that is just immaturity, but hopefully some hearts can be softened.

Marilyn

Marilyn,

I didn't want you to think that the article you shared hasn't been appreciated.  Kami and I talked about it on the phone and Timothy and I talked about it last night.  He hasn't read it yet, but he's planning on it.  I'm so glad you linked it!

Response to Marilyn

Alright, it is 11:21 and I feel like I've been hit by a tidal wave of exhaustion, so I will not comment extensively.  I read both articles you posted plus several of the links and I have a LOT to say.  I will post more about that later.

One thing I would like to touch on: I linked to the review of Sister Dew's book, and I have been feeling exactly like the reviewer.  WHY did Sister Dew feel the need to say she "isn't a feminist"?  Why, why, why???  Especially after she spent pages talking about "how far women have come" and the opportunities women have now that they didn't use to have.  It was such a slap in the face and felt so ungrateful. Yep, we're glad that so much progress has been made but we won't acknowledge the incredible women who fought for it.  I was truly disappointed and wish she hadn't brought it up if she isn't comfortable with the term.

Also, I too have been totally bugged by the complete lack of references to Heavenly Mother.  Since our Heavenly Mother is our MOTHER, first of all, and the embodiment of who we might become, second of all, you would think she'd be worthy of an honorable mention in the book.  How hard is it to include Her in statements like, "Heavenly Father created his daughters and loves them."  (I made up that sentence, but there were lots of pages about that topic.)  If you aren't going to say Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother then at least say God, which is understood to be both Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother.  I have been totally bugged by this so far in my reading.

Not that I haven't enjoyed the book so far.  Sister Dew has some awesome stuff to say, but she said at the beginning that she'll be criticized (sorry, Sister Dew!) by some for not going far enough (me) and criticized by others for going too far.  She's probably right.  :)

What always strikes me in these discussions about women's spiritual power and role is that I've never felt marginalized, even though I think about these issues a lot.  I've been angry about a lot of things, but not marginalized.  I've always had a profound respect for motherhood and womanhood (probably why I've studied these things) and it still surprises me when I find out how many women don't feel equal to a priesthood-holding man.  Mind-boggling.  The only thing I'll touch on here about the article, Marilyn, is that none of it sounded foreign or far-fetched or like she was clutching at straws.  I just wish I could preach it.

Also, I was really bugged at first when Elder Oaks referred to the Relief Society as an "appendage" as I thought it was rather patronizing, but after much pondering I came to the conclusion that since Relief Society isn't our primary responsibility in the world, that Elder Oaks was correct and not patronizing.  This article further clarifies that for me.

Good night.

PS  If this baby is a boy I really want to name him Badger Marion.  Timothy is not on board and I haven't told the name to many people because I haven't wanted to hear about it.  But of three people I've told, two have LOVED it.  Sincerely.  So, now I feel better.  Timothy calls him Baby Aardvark, which makes me laugh.  We're not fighting about names this time.  I told him what I was naming the baby if it is a girl (Flannery Mildred) and what I was naming the baby if it is a boy (Badger Marion), and I wasn't looking for any other options.  If he wants a different name, he has to come up with it and convince me to like it.  I should have done that with all the kids.  We've had some hilarious baby-naming discussions (T-Rex, anyone?), but I haven't gotten irritated because the ball is in his court.  If only I'd done that with Emeline, I might have gotten Clementine.  Oh well, that is the only baby name fight I've lost and Emeline is a gorgeous name.

Women, priesthood, and Priesthood

I still haven't read Sheri Dew's book, but this is a great article that draws from it. I love this article because it takes several of my half-formed thoughts to their logical, and more detailed, conclusion. And her thoughts on hearing Elder Oaks' comments that "not all keys have been given to the church" (ie priesthood leaders)--mirror mine exactly. Doesn't it follow that some of the keys are given to women, not through the church priesthood structure, but through a parallel structure of "priestesshood," as she calls it? I love that. Loved Elder Oaks' talk, too.

http://squaretwo.org/Sq2ArticleCasslerOaksBallardDew.html

Read it and then tell me what you think!

 

Yes.

Great article, Andrea. Here's another one (along the same lines) I read recently and thought everyone should read. http://www.sixteensmallstones.org/apostasy-as-conspiracy-theory-reason-logic-insanity-and-mormon-intellectualism/

 

 

Me too

I've been intending to read Sheri Dew's book forever. But we all know which road is paved with good intentions. Don't we.

PS I second the "aww" about little Faith; what a sweetie!

Awwww

Kelly, Faith is adorable!  Congrats!!!!  Do order the book!

Women and the Priesthood

I've heard GREAT things about Sister Dew's book but haven't had a chance to read it yet.

Andrea - thanks for remembering our little baby!  She is here - she is actually six months old now and SO perfect.  We named her Faith Aspen.  Josh's dad said it was a hippie name (ha, - kind of).  I always wanted a Faith, and Aspen - I don't know - it just was a top contender for some weird reason even though it is not our usual style.  Josh and the kids chose the name when they met her for the first time at the hospital.

our family blog has pictures www.coastcrew2@blogspot.com
if you click over you should skim down to the post on our summer reading challenge.  There is a cool picture I found online - "these are your kids on books" - that I think you'll like.  :-)

We love our baby SO much.  Can't hardly stand it.  Part of me thinks this is our last one, but part of me is very sad at the thought of that!

I will have to order Sister Dew's book.  It would be great to have in our library.

Sister Dew's New Book

I just started reading Women and the Priesthood by Sister Dew and already I'm bubbling over with commentary.  Anyone else reading it?  Have read it? Want to read it?  Want to chat about it with me???

Are we all still alive?  Kelly, we never heard about the arrival of number 6.  Would love hear the details.  

Someone read it!!!  My hubby gets tired of this topic but I never do because I keep learning so much!!!

my input on the final birth control subject

I practically never look at this blog these days.. I didn't know I was missing so much!!

HI.
It's funny how we all seem to be going through the same process (end of family thoughts).  At least, Andrea, Kelly and I are.  :-)

YES this has been heard before.  I've been preached the no birth control and no permanent control all my life.  So, it's no wonder I went into a serious depression after getting an IUD years ago (thinking I'd committed a dire sin).  After #6 we were back to condoms.  But, like Andrea, that will NOT work for the long run.

I really, really, really believe in and want to follow the open womb/closed womb principle.  It's my husband that doesn't have faith in that one.  But I do.  I can't not after having the experiences I've had with when, how and why my babies come (or don't come) into our lives.  I have a couple of friends who seriously live with this principle and it works for them.  They're still watchful and careful of their cycles, but it's not like NFP.    Anyway, that would be so ideal for me.  :-)

However, I had a very pleasant experience with the IUD (after my initial shock and sinner response) and so am leaning toward that route when our family is all here.  However, I still do have the "what am I doing to my body?" questions and this decision will be a matter of long prayers!

On the permanent side of things:  even this can go in so many directions.  What one couple deems as a medical issue may be nothing to another couple.  I have a friend who got a hysterectomy after her third baby and swears by them!  There were some medical issues for her...but one of those that others could judge as not necessarily life threatening or anything.

So... Honestly....in all matters between husband and wife, and individually, this subject must be taken up with the Lord.  I think we take in too much of what others say.  It's great to learn from all of the statements, "study it out in your mind and your heart," right?  But once you receive personal confirmation (after seeking and praying) it really doesn't matter what the stake president says, what the handbook says, or what your friends on a blog say!  :-)  That's why I like Andrea's approach in sharing how she came to a decision on the matter.  It was her answer, maybe helpful to others reading, and yet it wasn't "this is how it has to be for everyone" answer.  You know what I mean?

Anyway, such a timely topic for all of us.